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Andy Sephton

Crow Brakes and Flap set Up on a Phase 6 Question

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Andy Sephton

I'm an experienced modeller and I've successfully flown aerobatic slope soarers in the past ... the very distant past ... in the days of 3 channel radio with rudder, elevator and ailerons only.  Having been away from this discipline for some 35 years, I'm jumping back into the deep end with a Phase 6 and FrSky radio.  The first questions I have are as follows:

- How much deflection do I need on the ailerons and flaps, both up and down.

- Where is the best place to hinge the flaps, top surface, middle or bottom surface.

- What are the best or preferred hinges to use.

- How do I set up the transmitter - I can leave this one until later as the model is still in build.  For info, I'm still using FrSky softaware as it gives me what I need on the models I'm currently flying.

I'd be grateful for your thoughts and responses, so thanks in advance....

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satinet

Travel - go with the instructions if you have them. I would say in the range of 10 to 20mm for the ailerons depending on preferences.

As you have flaps this complicates the issue slightly. You want the flaps to move as well in response as you are losing aileron area. Perceived wisdom on larger models is that the flaps move around 1/3 as much as the ailerons.  But this is a small model with a flat wing so they might be better to match the ailerons.

I have never flown a 'kipper' with flaps so i don't have direct experience. Make yourself aware of the dual rate setting on your radio. (I.e two or more different movement settings on a switch). 

Hinge - for the most down travel then definitely bottom hinge with a top driven linkage. If you only want a moderate amount of travel then whatever the kit specifices.

Top or bottom hinge is going to be either tape or Silicon as there is nothing to glue to like a centre hinge. E.g a CA hinge.

I don't know anything about the frsky software I'm afraid.

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Andy Sephton

Thanks Satinet.  There's no information in the instructions about flap hinging or travel.  Nor is there any information on control surface deflection.  I'm hoping that there is somebody out there who has built the model with flaps, ailerons and crow brakes whose experience I can take advantage of.

 

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satinet

If you Google phase 6 with flaps there are a number of build logs.

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wookman

Hinge the surfaces the opposite side to the drive using tape. I would top hinge and bottom drive the ailerons and bottom hinge and top drive the flaps. Aileron throw as Chris's instructions. Flaps a little less as ailerons. Flaps as flaps under crow down as much as you can up to a max of 90° down with a little up aileron and elevator compensation on a curve mix. Lots to begin with in the usual way then levelling off as more flap is applied. Maybe use Mike Shillims F3f template as a starting point on rc soar.

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Geoffers

There's a great write up from an age back on RCMF which I use for flap set up.  http://www.rcmf.co.uk/4um/index.php?topic=48477.0

This relates to top-hinged; bottom-driven mouldie wings but the essence is to get maximum flap down-deflection in crow, with the servo arms horizontal at that point to minimise the possibility of servo gear stripping if you catch a flap on landing.  Quite difficult to describe, but essentially if the servo arm is "down" there's a lot of rotational torque to strip your gears, but if it's horizontal the forces are linear not rotational so hopefully bad things don't happen.

I'm using a Multiplex Cockpit SX TX, so don't know how to program FrSky, but I'm sure mates have used this TX successfully 

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Andy Sephton

Thanks for all the quick responses, they're much appreciated.  

I think I now have a plan for building the model, so I'm going to leave this thread as is and start a build thread when I have something relevant to post.

In summary:

- Geoffers - That's a great idea.  Unfortunately the link to the pictures didn't work, but I do get the idea and it's a good one. I'll be aiming to use it on the model when I set up the flaps.

- Wookman - I can't find 'Mike Shillims F3f' template, a steer as to where it is would be good, please?  The message I get, though is that I need lots of down flap available.

- Satinet - I've tried the Phase 6 threads, but they don't answer the questions. However, I have found the control deflections in the instructions, so that one is now solved.

For info, I'll be center hinging the ailerons and flaps with hinge-points.  By offsetting the hinge line into the control, I can easily get up to 90 degrees deflection.  It should all come clear in the build blog.  I'll also be putting the servos underneath as I don't want to spoil the looks of the top surface.

That's all for now, thanks for listening....

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wookman

Hi Andy.

www.rcsoar is Mikes website. I am not sure where it is exactly. I don't use open tx. The ideal is 90 degrees of down flap though this is rarely achieved. Anything over 45 degrees will have an affect.

The idea is not to land with the flaps down but slap them shut immediately prior to touch down. If you land with them down you will break something, gearbox, servo arm, clevis, pushrod, horn or hinge. Something will give eventually. slap um shut before touchdown. 

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tonym

Photos of my 'rough and ready' (sorry Mel 🙂 ) Phase 6 wing. Servo cover off for no other reason than I forgot to put it back after upgrading the servos. Ailerons middle hinged, 3 hinges per aileron. Servos epoxied straight in - I'm an animal 😄

p6_wing.thumb.png.68008dddbfd9e9e85843bec7d9b9f0b7.png

p6_flap.thumb.png.101f86ecf67b1f74f65160547f3560a2.png

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