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Anyone got a new model ?


PeteMitchell

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My new model finished this week just before Christmas 2020:

A bit of history first:

Hello to the few of you out there who still remember me from the earliest days, from the first year of BARCS’s Thermal Soaring Group in fact!

I have long since given up Competitive T/S but was tempted get back into it & to take up this new fangled Electric Launch discipline.

This also was some time ago and in fact the first competitive year of electric launch T/S so I purchased an Ava from Hyperflight intending to compete in the second competitive season.

However after I had attempted to ‘move heaven’ in the impossible task of reliably setting the maximum possible watts per kilo weight of the model to an acceptable level there transpired an unholy ‘discussion’ on line & in the relevant circles regarding new rules for electric launch, the result being a split with at least two sets of rules immerging. The result for me was that I despaired with it all & gave up the idea altogether!

Fast forward to the second 2020 lockdown, thinking of what I shall next build, or more like it these days, what shall I buy & assemble, it was then I happened upon this silly named ‘Introduction to F5J’ model from Grüner in Deutschland.

Erm it seemed to be a modern but proper model kit, made of wood, sinue & a bit of this carbon stuff which is quite good & the whole thing might take more than a few covid free hours to stick together? So I Googled it to find no other than Hyperflight (I’d heard of them) have stock.

Being the impetuous buyer that I am the next day it arrived but by then I had completed more Googleing & discovered that I had ordered the original kit & there was an updated design called ‘Inside’ with a 6 servo wing available, I want that one!

The supplier was not disposed to change the kit for the new version (don’t go there) so I seriously explored & considered the possibility of my converting the basic flap/spoiler wing to the full six flapping bits version. I decided it was certainly feasible & have since discovered that there might even have been enough wood in the kit left over to do it, other than for the necessary solid wood bits for the extra four aileron/flap surfaces.

Long term gliding mate Ian Nicholls persuaded me with logic to build the kit ‘as is’ (You are still not going to use it competitively, are you? You’ll be doing deckchair sit down & going to sleep floating about!) yep he was right of course, so that’s what we have here.

The six servo wing only kit is available at least from Germany but not for what I consider to be reasonable cost & you would not want or need both wings anyway, if you fancy that then better to buy the full ‘Inside’ kit in the first place!

I must say Mr Grüner certainly knows his stuff, the kit is a quite magnificent example of the relatively new art of laser cutting technology.

I have built British laser cut semi kits of old timer designs which in terms of parts fitting together do not begin to approach the quality of this kit.

To be fair this was my first example of a kit specifically designed for laser technology production, come to think of it it is also the very first modern built up kit design I have built which has a multi coloured Autocad plan!

As a retired engineer the multicolored plan is really good, so much easier to read at least for old tired eyes.

Every single part fitted absolutely perfectly even down to the geodetic 3mmx3mm point ended/differing angles tailplane braces, not a single part needed a helping hand to fit exactly!

As for those 3x3 braces the afore mentioned British kit would have at best given you a piece of 3mm square & expected you to fashion them yourself!

The balsa was clearly perfectly selected for the task intended & suitably marked on individual parts themselves therefore not lost on the sheet once released.

The parts are retained in the sheets from which they are cut by the usual two or three tabs of uncut material, I released the parts by the use of the point of a No11 scalpel blade which was about double the width of the laser cut!     

During construction of the wing I did consider it rather light & fragile, not a D box type but 1.5mm balsa ribs & riblets on a tubular carbon spar, 2mm dia solid carbon LE, slotted hard balsa TE in the case of the flap area & 1mm ply TE for the outer panels.

It is necessary to take care when handling, I am light of hand but managed to damage a couple of ribs during handling & sanding etc.

However once the covering is applied, I used transparent Orocover & also a Banggood variety, the wing is firm and feels as firm & solid as any built up D box model wing structure.          

The kit contained all parts required to complete the airframe including hardware, wing joiners, unique style dihedral braces, wing retainers, wing servo boxes, GRP horns, wire, snakes, nuts, bolts, quik-links, even magnets for the canopy cover etc, etc but not covering.   

Not flown it yet & it will be another couple of weeks at least before I will be able due to the latest Covid Tier 4 lockdown in our area but I’m certain it will perform excellently.  

 

Regards and as Happy a Christmas as you can manage to all!

Rob Cavell

BARCS 78

Intro F5J 002a.jpg

Intro F5J 001a.jpg

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On 19/12/2020 at 15:32, wixy said:

There are some new props becoming available,  designed by  Julian Benz and manufactured by servorahmen.

They do need a cranked hub to enable them to fold flat , at least they do on my Prestige fus. Julian designed them around Explorer/Xplorer fus that he uses so they may fit them without the cranked hub.

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thermaldoctor
32 minutes ago, PeteMitchell said:

They do need a cranked hub to enable them to fold flat , at least they do on my Prestige fus. Julian designed them around Explorer/Xplorer fus that he uses so they may fit them without the cranked hub.

Got a load coming in and will be testing. Only thing I am unsure of is same prop size for 3s and 4s? I will test on both. Dont think same size for both  is optimal. We will see. Plus will do structural integrity tests shame ground is so soft. 

Regards

Neil

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7 hours ago, Rob Cavell said:

Rob Cavell

BARCS 78

Intro F5J 002a.jpg

Intro F5J 001a.jpg

Nice work Bob.    I've recently finished my Inside F5J and look forward to better (and warmer) weather to fly it again. 

As you have found, I thought that the kit quality was very good...    

 

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  • 2 weeks later...
On 21/12/2020 at 13:06, Rob Cavell said:

My new model finished this week just before Christmas 2020:

A bit of history first:

Hello to the few of you out there who still remember me from the earliest days, from the first year of BARCS’s Thermal Soaring Group in fact!

I have long since given up Competitive T/S but was tempted get back into it & to take up this new fangled Electric Launch discipline.

This also was some time ago and in fact the first competitive year of electric launch T/S so I purchased an Ava from Hyperflight intending to compete in the second competitive season.

However after I had attempted to ‘move heaven’ in the impossible task of reliably setting the maximum possible watts per kilo weight of the model to an acceptable level there transpired an unholy ‘discussion’ on line & in the relevant circles regarding new rules for electric launch, the result being a split with at least two sets of rules immerging. The result for me was that I despaired with it all & gave up the idea altogether!

Fast forward to the second 2020 lockdown, thinking of what I shall next build, or more like it these days, what shall I buy & assemble, it was then I happened upon this silly named ‘Introduction to F5J’ model from Grüner in Deutschland.

Erm it seemed to be a modern but proper model kit, made of wood, sinue & a bit of this carbon stuff which is quite good & the whole thing might take more than a few covid free hours to stick together? So I Googled it to find no other than Hyperflight (I’d heard of them) have stock.

Being the impetuous buyer that I am the next day it arrived but by then I had completed more Googleing & discovered that I had ordered the original kit & there was an updated design called ‘Inside’ with a 6 servo wing available, I want that one!

The supplier was not disposed to change the kit for the new version (don’t go there) so I seriously explored & considered the possibility of my converting the basic flap/spoiler wing to the full six flapping bits version. I decided it was certainly feasible & have since discovered that there might even have been enough wood in the kit left over to do it, other than for the necessary solid wood bits for the extra four aileron/flap surfaces.

Long term gliding mate Ian Nicholls persuaded me with logic to build the kit ‘as is’ (You are still not going to use it competitively, are you? You’ll be doing deckchair sit down & going to sleep floating about!) yep he was right of course, so that’s what we have here.

The six servo wing only kit is available at least from Germany but not for what I consider to be reasonable cost & you would not want or need both wings anyway, if you fancy that then better to buy the full ‘Inside’ kit in the first place!

I must say Mr Grüner certainly knows his stuff, the kit is a quite magnificent example of the relatively new art of laser cutting technology.

I have built British laser cut semi kits of old timer designs which in terms of parts fitting together do not begin to approach the quality of this kit.

To be fair this was my first example of a kit specifically designed for laser technology production, come to think of it it is also the very first modern built up kit design I have built which has a multi coloured Autocad plan!

As a retired engineer the multicolored plan is really good, so much easier to read at least for old tired eyes.

Every single part fitted absolutely perfectly even down to the geodetic 3mmx3mm point ended/differing angles tailplane braces, not a single part needed a helping hand to fit exactly!

As for those 3x3 braces the afore mentioned British kit would have at best given you a piece of 3mm square & expected you to fashion them yourself!

The balsa was clearly perfectly selected for the task intended & suitably marked on individual parts themselves therefore not lost on the sheet once released.

The parts are retained in the sheets from which they are cut by the usual two or three tabs of uncut material, I released the parts by the use of the point of a No11 scalpel blade which was about double the width of the laser cut!     

During construction of the wing I did consider it rather light & fragile, not a D box type but 1.5mm balsa ribs & riblets on a tubular carbon spar, 2mm dia solid carbon LE, slotted hard balsa TE in the case of the flap area & 1mm ply TE for the outer panels.

It is necessary to take care when handling, I am light of hand but managed to damage a couple of ribs during handling & sanding etc.

However once the covering is applied, I used transparent Orocover & also a Banggood variety, the wing is firm and feels as firm & solid as any built up D box model wing structure.          

The kit contained all parts required to complete the airframe including hardware, wing joiners, unique style dihedral braces, wing retainers, wing servo boxes, GRP horns, wire, snakes, nuts, bolts, quik-links, even magnets for the canopy cover etc, etc but not covering.   

Not flown it yet & it will be another couple of weeks at least before I will be able due to the latest Covid Tier 4 lockdown in our area but I’m certain it will perform excellently.  

 

Regards and as Happy a Christmas as you can manage to all!

Rob Cavell

BARCS 78

Intro F5J 002a.jpg

Intro F5J 001a.jpg

However once the covering is applied, I used transparent Orocover & also a Banggood variety, the wing is firm and feels as firm & solid as any built up D box model wing structure.

After you have dozed off in your chair whilst flying, this model, you may need to fly it back on the fast side and I don't share your view on the wing being firm enough to with stand flexing when flown fast. Even fully sheeted wings, that have modern thin sections, can and do flutter when flown fast, which can occur under the power phase.

That said good to hear you are back in the fold, playing with some toys😉😉

Best regards

Brian

BARCS 230

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  • 2 weeks later...
Martin Church

Have to agree that Grunher CNC are indeed fabulous at what they do. I’ve assembled a laser cut kit if the Slite V2 an f3res design & everything fits together like a glove very happy with what I managed to put together over the Xmas holiday of it.

Expensive & over engineered? yes

Worth every penny? Definitely 

334F9996-E5AD-4293-8508-D2A53186D21F.jpeg

B935992A-107F-4C81-B48C-FC65FF690CE2.jpeg

D84194D8-041F-431C-B59F-4FBFB01F22FF.jpeg

Edited by Martin Church
Few photos for interest
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  • 4 weeks later...

The 2 models above look superb. I read each with envy, that the laser cutting was perfection. Here is the other extreme – everything hand cut.

I did fancy building an F5RES model, but there was nothing I could fancy. Or, there was too much choice, so I elected to throw one of my nightmares together. This has an upper and lower round spar and all the holes are drilled by hand,

Here it is, and what a nightmare it was. Only finished yesterday and given a few throws across the lawn. It actually flies, so that is a good start.

Well, other than its very first test glide ended up in a tree – but it really was too windy for it ! (a real sign there is too much wood and not enough carbon)

PS - Chinese covering is not really as good as ProFilm Lite...... but glory be, a sight cheaper.

BomDuck.JPG.4456b7b0597f202c0a8fca4d346962b5.JPG

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  • 2 weeks later...

New model !

Ecirtech Stellar F5J - all wood built up kit - I bought it ready built in December - from an ad on BMFA - was the original owners build project in the last lockdown. He said it went together well - certainly looks well built. Hoping to get it in the air in springtime - lots of covering to do - transparent of course to show off those lovely wingtips.

Link to website:

https://www.ecirtech.fr/stellar-f5j/

Phil.

Stellar_1.thumb.jpg.2c84adf4141b94318b47b63b2d945e72.jpgStellar_3.thumb.jpg.ff92c5d1bb20d6ab0410d7d3421ca6c7.jpg

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Sorry I've not been replying to this thread but  the reply to topic box has not been appearing in my browser, got it sorted now.

I like all these built up models I had no idea there were so many about.

I'm impressed simply because I'm more of a traditional Builderman than a Mouldieman, no problem with Mouldies they are genuinely impressive & I'm not put off with the cost because I could afford them but I'm just and old fart!

Hi Brian, sorry for the belated reply, was nice to hear from you again, yes of course you are right the wing of the Intro is not actually as stiff as any D box (let alone one of yours!) but I was generally impressed for what it is, however still not flown it yet so better reserve final judgement.

     

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  • 2 weeks later...

On February 7th (above) I posted a pick of my new F5RES model. Many people post picks of their new creations, but there is no follow up.

This has now done a couple of hours in the air and seems reasonable. Most of these F5RES kits claim about 450g in the air. This is almost 200g over that weight and flies very light. It certainly does not like over about 6 or 7mph breeze.

So, here we have a short clip of part of a flight and the associated log that went with it.

 

VidFlight..thumb.png.91a4f928e62689ad7b36a238ac112ec1.png

 

 

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51 minutes ago, oipigface said:

Wot? No thermals?

I'm working on that - besides, it is the middle of winter and I'm much further north in the frozen Tundra.

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Marc RC pilot
On 16/02/2021 at 21:36, Phil.Taylor said:

New model !

Ecirtech Stellar F5J - all wood built up kit - I bought it ready built in December - from an ad on BMFA - was the original owners build project in the last lockdown. He said it went together well - certainly looks well built. Hoping to get it in the air in springtime - lots of covering to do - transparent of course to show off those lovely wingtips.

Link to website:

https://www.ecirtech.fr/stellar-f5j/

Phil.

Stellar_1.thumb.jpg.2c84adf4141b94318b47b63b2d945e72.jpgStellar_3.thumb.jpg.ff92c5d1bb20d6ab0410d7d3421ca6c7.jpg

Amazing birds of flight gentlemen! Good show 👌

The intricacy of the laser cut parts is quite something...The trailing edges on both Phil's wings and tail and that beautiful complex looking rib structure on those wing tips...Oh Lord :)

These kits must be a real treat to put together for sure and they all look very tempting for future projects.

Questions if I may:  Why stick to just E/R (with brakes) as opposed to having some wing control/ailerons? Is it because they are inherently stable with their polyhedral wing configuration etc/design specifically for task in hand/required for certain comp rules? Save weight/extra flaff ? Please excuse my ignorance 

Cheers

PS Stellar F5J build manual, great stuff :)

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Phil.Taylor
2 hours ago, Marc RC pilot said:

Looks like the stellar has both flaps and ailerons?

 

Yep - flaps and ailerons

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5 hours ago, Marc RC pilot said:

These kits must be a real treat to put together

If you read Graham Woods’ review (favonius.com) of the Svollazzo (not made by Ecirtech) you might change your mind. The Batwing I built last year from a laser cut kit was a real pleasure to put together mind.

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