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NCFM Moth build

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isoaritfirst

What laminating film did you use Jules, It varies in thicknes and a lot and it does change how to put it on.

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julianb

Hi Mike, it was the thin stuff that Abbo sells. Just got to master it's application!

 

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Scram
On ‎28‎/‎01‎/‎2016 at 16:19, julianb said:

Hi Mike, it was the thin stuff that Abbo sells. Just got to master it's application!

If that is the same as the NS I got from Abbo, it is not thin compared to the NS that Mike and Steve have been using.  I thought I had the thinner stuff which is actually 120 micron thick whilst Mike n Steve are using 75 and/or 42 micron thick stuff  B)

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Scram

2 Moths maidened today and 1 Taranis +  :)

20160130_110305.jpg.f8c735800f28265de793

Dave and I went to Honey Hill and the wind was due W so perfect for that little lump.  Quite blustery but not so strong as it would blow out the lift of which there was plenty from time to time.

As recommended, I started mine with a bit of lead stuck on the nose.  Seemed to fly OK but I landed and took it off and I think it was going better but we were now getting cold fingers so time for a cuppa  :thumbsup:

After warming up, I put the little lump of lead back on just in front of the fin.  Even better and no sign of hyperstall, in fact flew well inverted with just a little down ele.  I think a spot of expo on the ailerons would be good as it was very reactive to little input.

Flew the Typhoon as well - all OK but landing resulted in a gentle ground loop - checked controls and the elevator again was duff, no movement at all.  I broke a Savox 225 with a flat, vertical landing onto a footpath when flying with Rog at Newquay and fond it had broken a tooth off the metal output gear - the biggest one!!  :huh:  I replaced the gear with one from a spare frazzled servo but it's not been right since.  Think I will put a new one in.

Dave flew his phoon also and all was well, we went home happy.

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isoaritfirst

Massive lift today on pole cot. Flying the gulp with markS, I came in from a dot actually I think it was a o. Third smaller than a dot. Had a quick check to see were mark was as I approached the slope edge in a very fast vertical dive. All fine he was out of the way, trouble was the slope wasn't, although I think I felt it move. Just managed to slightly pull up and flatten on to the slope with a nice thud. Seemed ok so off again. But next landing was less than perfect and the nose has broke off. Typical gulp injury. My old one never suffered with. So I think it's more tape in the rebuild tomorrow. 

Then raced the bluto with mark flying his small skua. Close in and very fast. Skua needs some repair and bluto should be ok with a run over with the iron. Pretty surprising considering the thud when they had a coming together. 

Day was just too fast for racing mom. 

 

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evad

yep had a great time up there today , was a little cold but both moths seemed to be flying well , I didn't mess with the cog on mine I just left it set as it was for today 

its a shame the the servo in jerry typhoon packed up but at least it wasn't in the air when it happened .....

the photos didn't turn out that good jerry but here's a couple from today phpru6BS9AM.jpg.17781fa00a1eeca4a4d869b5

not sure what this bloke was doing ?

php16WzgnAM.jpg.34e0a8a1e103e2887b7731d1

 

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Scram

.....  it's called recovering from unplanned arrival  :P

sorry I did not get any more pics.

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ChuckGlider

I had an awesome day flying on Mickey's West at the Bwlch on Saturday. Wind speed 25 - 30 mph.

The Moth gave a good account of itself, surprisingly as it is unballasted. However, the Polecat was ripping up the sky big time, with huge loops and going ballistic for what seemed like ages. God I love it when its like that!

 

20160130_131442274_iOS.jpg

20160130_131457310_iOS.jpg

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julianb
On 30/01/2016 at 18:46, isoaritfirst said:

Typical gulp injury. My old one never suffered with. So I think it's more tape in the rebuild tomorrow.

Broke my Gulp DS in two on it's maiden. C.G. a smidge rearward, launch, model rears up, drops its nose and comes straight down behind me, breaking its back across a dry stone wall. I thought Andy Ellison was quite literally going to split his sides.... ;-) Tacked it back on, wrapped it with some cross weave and carried on flying!!! Proper fix back at the shop later...Loved that model. It was a tank!!!

 

 

 

 

AMIDS22.JPG

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isoaritfirst

I had the Bluto with me, which was better suited to the strong conditions. So not much reason to tape it back together, but I di dconsider it. It would have been an easy slope side fix if I had had need to.

I remember that pic Jules. 

I've never had the DS version but did fly one a few times it did seem very settled and nice. I have a JW60 so never had place for one - but always fancied trying as a comparison.

 

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ChuckGlider

Here's some video of Saturday's action. My mates Phil, with his Flyingwings Spectre, Clive with his homebrew plank, The Stug, (which actually flies a lot quicker than is depicted in this video, and my Moth.

 

 

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evad

went up and chucked mine of the local hill today , I have been playing with the cog position and also using the ballast ,

I moved the cog back a little to 37mm from the leading edge and settled on using just 4 of the brass ballast , I found that filling the tube with all 10 made the model seem less responsive to the controls and didn't feel as comfortable to fly

also I have reduced the elevator throw a little more

came home after an hour and a half cold but happy :D

dave   

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isoaritfirst

My gulp is now back together and test flown today. I suspect the check has changed slightly but in the big lift we had today it was fine. I will have to wait for a more gentle day to nail the cg and elevator settings. Hyper stalling is more visible when trying to corner in poorer lift. 

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ChuckGlider

Hi guys

I'm hoping someone can point me in the right direction with an issue I'm having.

My Moth will roll perfectly to the right, all nicely axial, nice and slow, or as fast as you like, and so when doing a reversal it rolls nicely onto its back ready for me to input up elevator.

However, doing the same to the left is totally different. Rolls to the left are very barrel like and she just won't roll onto her back when doing a reversal, she just seems to want to go straight into a sharp turn,so she loses half her speed when trying to change direction.

I've tried adding aileron differential, but that made it worse in both directions, the model barrel rolling rather than being axial. In fact, it doesn't seem to like aileron diff at all. I've also tried reducing the amount of up, left hand aileron a little, but that had little effect.

Helllllllllllp :frantics:

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oipigface

Flying wings generally don't take well to aileron diff because it's like changing the reflex every time you apply an aileron movement. It's not clear why adding diff would solve a problem that appears to be due to an asymmetry somewhere in the model. 

I would check:

i) Is the wing straight or does one side have a different angle of attack from the other?

ii) Are the elevon throws equal on each side? I.e. Up=up, down=down.

iii) Is the fin on straight? (Vertically and longitudinally)

iv) Have you got the same amount of reflex on both elevons?

v) is the model laterally balanced?

vi) Anything else you can think of that may different on one side rather the other!

 

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isoaritfirst

These planks work best with very small throws and very finely tuned rearward cg  

the problem with such sensative settings is that any error in the build is magnified   

Differential can be used in a racing model to induce a barrel roll. This may suit a particular model or pilots flying style?. Creating a nose down style turn. It will however create problems in general sports flying or inverted flying and I wouldn't recommend it. It's certainly not a cure to a problem, although you may find a setting which effectively takes out a build error that is inducing differential. This is unlikely though.

best course of action is to go back to earlier in this thread and follow  my set up advice  

 

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Royski

I have just started using differential on my Moth, it is useful when the lift is light and helps keep the turns a little flatter, once height is gained I switch it off and use the inertial to get it round the turns.

It definately doesn't like differential in the roll

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isoaritfirst

Accurate cg placement is paramount. If you have it too far forward then you will have too much reflex in the wing. Once inverted this reflex will of course need taking out before adding more down stick to again compensate for the heavy nose. 

flying slow in weak lift is the best way to get a good setting. Go as far back as you can and keep adjusting throws as you go. Try to find a spot where you can get the model to fly inverted with very little down stick and no hyperstalling  again in weak lift  less than 10 mph off a grassy knoll not the wrecker  

Once you have nailed the change then address the throws to ensure they are all equal  

i also would recommend that you cut off and rehinge the elevons correctly  

then arrange so that servos move to at least 40% preferably more each way and elevons move no more than 25 degrees.  It's no good rating them down  it has to be done in the linkage  . Do not be gready with your throws  fast rolls are bad  news unless they are the result of flying fast  

 

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MooSe

Just out of interest, reference setting throws. 

I've just finished repairing a Mike Young Stinger epp plank (was a wing he cut years ago for the epp 60 series.  I remember in his 1st race with his fresh Stinger, it got mid aired and suffered a smashed spar.  I swapped a beater miniblade for a short kit he had ) and have just finished setting the throws. I hate faffing with the tx trying to inc and dec a touch screen whilst holding a ruler.  So I took the ruler, stuck some masking tape to it and offered it up to the respective elevon. I then marked the neutral datum and measured and marked my desired throws from it. Now all I had to do was hold the ruler and adjust accordingly to each Mark without trying to read off measurents. 

Worked a treat. :rolleyes:

And going back to the trimming and c of g  discussion. I had to repair after a nasty cartwheel.  I was just nailing the cofg but was too lazy to rate back the elevator.  A brief but fast test flight resulted in a silly and avoidable splat! Always pays to take your time and adjust those rates! 

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isoaritfirst

I normally use digital measuring caliper. I'm not especially interested in the read out but they do lock nicely to a size which can then be transferred. 

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