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F3-RES UK Competition Interest


Neil Stainton

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Hi

 

I fly a MADRes that I purchased from a member on this forum and regularly submit to the online comp run on here. If we can get enough people together I would love to enter a days competition.  Just not sure how much interest there is?

Also we would have to be sensible with the weather as I agree with other contributors on here that good days are few and far between. 
 

Guy

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SilentPilot
On 09/08/2018 at 16:48, cirrusRC said:

the alternative is to stick a motor in your RES.   Doesn't add much more weight and performance is still very good. 

I did the opposite! 

I took the prop off my Radian, taped up the cooling holes and added a belly hook :)

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12 hours ago, Pete in Northiam said:

Happy New Year all! Just to say at least two of us in the East Sussex Soaring Association are building F3-RES models for competition in 2020 (including the 2m Challenge) and we have just received RES-Eagle kits from RBC. I found this thread because many people were complaining elsewhere that the current HK bungee is rubbish compared to the original postal rules.

I also have a Euro standard  F3-RES bungee from Hyperflight.  These are excellent and still available.  I have launched my 100" Kloudrider from it for good thermal hunting.

Could we consider using those, either full length or shortened, as a standard for this comp in 2020? I appreciate the desire to keep launch height down.

Cheers --Pete

It sure would make sense to use the same 'official' F3-RES spec bungee used by both the Germans and Americans...

I built my bungee to that spec using the same rubber from hyperflight.  I've only used it to launch my 100" Flair Sunrise for a few test flights in the park.  I was going to buy and build an F3-RES kit for this year but the insistence on deviating from the official standards used by both the Europeans and Americans has put me off a bit and so it has dropped way down my list of priorities.

 

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SilentPilot

I built a lower spec bungee for use in the 14 day challenges.

Cost less than £10 all in. I'm no builder by any means, my time and skills are extremely limited, but even I managed to make one! 

1445409732_RadianCombo.JPG.thumb.jpg.8f196f999b4dd7c67e4364b786cd53be.jpg

ps

I did get a proper holder for it in the end. Just a simple cable tidy from my local hardware store :)

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1 hour ago, JBF said:

It sure would make sense to use the same 'official' F3-RES spec bungee used by both the Germans and Americans...

I built my bungee to that spec using the same rubber from hyperflight.  I've only used it to launch my 100" Flair Sunrise for a few test flights in the park.  I was going to buy and build an F3-RES kit for this year but the insistence on deviating from the official standards used by both the Europeans and Americans has put me off a bit and so it has dropped way down my list of priorities.

 

The only deviation from the Euro rules (US Rules are very different indeed) is that for the postal we have a shorter line and bungee and the simple reason is to accommodate pilots flying in a small field. Its actually really good practice, you have to read the air very quickly and you cant mess up the launch so please don't be put off by our minor rule deviation. Having a short line certainly sharpens your flying skills.  When we get round to holding 'proper' contests then we will use standard length bungee/lines.

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2 hours ago, martynk said:

The only deviation from the Euro rules (US Rules are very different indeed) is that for the postal we have a shorter line and bungee and the simple reason is to accommodate pilots flying in a small field. Its actually really good practice, you have to read the air very quickly and you cant mess up the launch so please don't be put off by our minor rule deviation. Having a short line certainly sharpens your flying skills.  When we get round to holding 'proper' contests then we will use standard length bungee/lines.

I presume the postal is a way of building up interest until there is enough to warrant a contest?  Could you not allow the standard F3-RES bungee for the postal, but also allow a shorter/weaker bungee too?  That way those who want to can use a contest grade setup while others who prefer to challenge themselves further by using a smaller bungee are free to do so?   You may find some using the shorter bungee still outperform those using a longer variant due to differences in skill etc?   A postal contest with entrants flying from different sites at different times must already open it up for wide variations in potential performance due to local site and weather conditions, so, would having an additional 40m line on the bungee really make the world of difference?

 

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Whitmore

Bear in mind that the 14 day challenge is a 2m competition NOT an F3-RES competition. It includes aileron 2m models and foam models. It stems from the DLG challenges but yes was intended to be a rallying point for those interested in F3-RES. The smaller bungee was cheap and available at the time and the short line intended to roughly match a good F3K launch and to permit small field flying. An extra 40m would make things much easier launchwise.

If availablity is now an issue (surely you can still just get standard surgical rubber?) Then I suggest allowing a 15m bungee and 45m line for the same unstretched length.

Any actual F3-RES competition would be flown to the original rules naturally. In which case the launch bungees are provided by the organisers.

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Fair enough.  I didn't have any issues using my contest spec bungee in my local park although it was a bit weak for the 100" model (fine for initial test flights but difficult to 'get away' from the height achieved) - to me the biggest annoyance is dog walkers who seem completely baffled when they see a piece of line on the ground despite there being a guy standing flying a model glider nearby; must be all of those energy saving lightbulbs...  Guess this is why I find flying off of a slope more convenient if there's a light breeze in the correct direction.  Hmm there's an idea - F3-RES XC!

I'll just continue doing my thing and keep an eye out here.  If I do get around to building an F3-RES model and three's an occasional contest going then I'll possibly see you all on the field :)

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I would be happy to run a second league using a full length line but we barely have enough participants for the current short line league

 

F3-RES XC. Count me in 😂 

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Whitmore
On 01/01/2020 at 13:01, GuyB said:

fly a MADRes that I purchased from a member on this forum and regularly submit to the online comp run on here. If we can get enough people together I would love to enter a days competition.  Just not sure how much interest there is?

It seems something is actually in the works regarding a competition. I will let you know when I have details....

Jon

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  • 3 months later...
StraightEdge

I

On 06/01/2020 at 10:13, Whitmore said:

It seems something is actually in the works regarding a competition. I will let you know when I have details....

Jon

I'm interested Jon... with Boffin's X-RES 🙂

Jon

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  • 5 months later...

Not sure if this thread is still open, but if F3 RES doesn't take off (pun not intended), is there not an opening for a foamie class. Not requiring building, this could prove more popular. As almost all have motors, this would negate the problems with bungees. It could be called F5 foam. 

I've thoroughly enjoyed competing with my foamies in F5J (Eastern region), but against the mouldies, its an uphill struggle to come anywhere but last. 

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1 hour ago, Mr_SMO said:

Not sure if this thread is still open, but if F3 RES doesn't take off (pun not intended), is there not an opening for a foamie class. Not requiring building, this could prove more popular. As almost all have motors, this would negate the problems with bungees. It could be called F5 foam. 

I've thoroughly enjoyed competing with my foamies in F5J (Eastern region), but against the mouldies, its an uphill struggle to come anywhere but last. 

You will have the same problems getting people to turn up as you do in any class.

As much as I like to the idea of F3res I think it would be more successful if it were the dreaded electric. 

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On 27/09/2020 at 22:55, satinet said:

You will have the same problems getting people to turn up as you do in any class.

As much as I like to the idea of F3res I think it would be more successful if it were the dreaded electric. 

There are moves afoot to have a F5-RES class to the same basic rules but with an ALT limiter set to about 60m for our league or 120m for the proper rules. Still under discussion. All went on hold when the country got grounded earlier this year. Hopefully it will kick off again over winter.

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  • 2 weeks later...
On 27/09/2020 at 20:56, Mr_SMO said:

Not sure if this thread is still open, but if F3 RES doesn't take off (pun not intended), is there not an opening for a foamie class. Not requiring building, this could prove more popular. As almost all have motors, this would negate the problems with bungees. It could be called F5 foam. 

I've thoroughly enjoyed competing with my foamies in F5J (Eastern region), but against the mouldies, its an uphill struggle to come anywhere but last. 

When I started the Bartletts League, in 2009, it was with 3 classes of model with each having league within the group of contests. These were Open, 2 Metre and a Foamy Class. If you flew one entry, of the latter two, you had a chance of competing in both Open and either 2 Metre or the Foam class.

The foam class was dropped pretty soon, as there were few entry's, that dwindled to none as time went on. The 2 metre was reasonably supported, initially , mainly by the contest flyer who could maximize his flying on the day, by flying in 2 classes. Should point out, that if you flew 2 classes each of the your entry, your score would only apply to that class only.  Also, to have an even playing field, those flying 2 models, had to nominate, which of the two models was to count, as to it's position in the competition on the day.

At the end of the day, the majority of flyers enter a competition with high expectations, of their ability to do well. This will dictate that they choose type of model that will have the specification to compete, with all the models being flown, the position achieved then being down to the flyers ability. Simon, is an exception to the above, as he enjoys just being in the cut & thrust of competing.

An F5-RES class would garner more interest, as electric has done in the other classes.

 

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I did actuly suggest a F5-RES class a couple of years ago but no one rose to the bait. I think that it would co exist well with F3-RES 

Happy to run a mini league next year if there is sufficient interest.  Perhaps altitude limited to 75m though I am going off the idea of the one big flight. 

I would prefer 3 flights to a sensible (say 10 minute) max within a 60 minute launch window. 

 

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Reading the above, it seems the problem lays in drawing people in. They seem to be put off either by the cost of a competitive mouldy, or what they see as a bore in having to build it. Surely a RES designation doesn't change either, because if the class took off, the manufacturers would waste no time in producing a RES designated Explorer, Pike perfection,  etc. And you're back to square one. Your savings would amount to 3 or 4 servos. Whether it's F3 or F5 wouldn't be material.

Whilst as EssexBOF points out, I simply enjoy the competitive environment, I think to increase numbers, surely limiting size, eg 2m, or build material for a new class would be the way forward.

Just my tuppence worth.

 

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pete beadle

Hi all

My two pennorth

It seems to me that it's nothing to do with classes, it's to do with increasing the pool from which we draw our (potential) competition flyers

In my day you had to beat would-be competitors  off with a stick! The ISA Open I ran was regularly over subscribed and the comps like the Frogsnest "season-opener" was ALWAYS 100 - 120 plus

BUT I'm sorry, those days are now long gone, so, personally, I think the question should be changed from "Should we fly RES class in comps" because IMO it would just be the same competitors flying different classes, and "How do we increase the number of potential competitors?"

I have no idea - how about you guys?

Regards

Pete

BARCS1702 

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## "How do we increase the number of potential competitors?"##

Surely this is pure market forces? 

Make it cheaper, or more accessible. 

If we imagine, say a fete, or school open day, where F5J is being demonstrated, it would generate an audience, but when you told them it would cost £3k minimum to get started competitively, or you have to build a kit, I suspect the audience would filter away. 

Once they get told they can be competitive for a tenth of that in another class, and you can fly without having to build, there's a chance that their interest could be maintained. 

Again, just my tuppence worth. 

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The point about F3-RES is that it is a low cost entry level class. A competitive glider can be scratch built for about £100 or £200 from a kit and there are ARTF options available as well.  

I agree that the issue with SF is that there is a shortage of wannabe competitors, I suspect that of the 30k bmfa members I would guess that the current SF pool size is currently about 1% with another 1% potential competitors who may fly thermal gliders for fun. That latter group are not here, here we preach to the semi converted. 

I think that this sort of ratio applies to all competitive aeromodelling disciplines. I believe that the real task is to engage with the average club and sport fliers and try and enthuse them. Providing there is a viable entry level class - like 100S used to be before it went mouldy - and events local enough to save on excess travel then I think there is a way forward for competitive aeromodelling. One of the reasons why I Iike the concept of postal events. 

Perhaps we need Champions who will attend club nights and talk about thermal soaring and try and spread some of their enthusiasm. Post Covid of course. 😟

 

Just a thought... 

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