Jump to content
Richard Swindells

Inactivity report...

Recommended Posts

Skip

How many?

Industry led (as in led by those involved in the RC drone/UAV industry) , not led by the mythical boogy-man industry that controls governments and assassinates their opposition, industry.

There are very, very different levels of policing effort. This needs to be treated as a terrorist incident, at least for the practice.....

There are also different books and different interpretations. 

I didn't mean to imply that they weren't already trying their best. I'm sure each individual involved is trying their best.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Richard Swindells

i actually took half a day off work to go to one of the consultation workshops that was being run by the company contracted by the governemt to impliment drone registration/legislation.

It was actually a very constructive meeting, with reprisentitives from military suppliers, large-scale commercial operators and hobbists. I felt that all the points that I wanted to raise were listened to and taken into consideration. It felt to me like no-one from the traditional RC hobby had spoken to them up to that point, or if they had, they had not put their point across effectively. 

Essentially I was trying to convey the message that a lot of the assumtions being made in their legislation simply is not applicable to how we operate. The best analogy was that it was like trying to apply the same laws and regulation around commercial heavy goods vehicles, to a bicycle.

I dont know if anyone else from our side of the hobby went? Regardless, I would not be suprised that after gatwick, there will be moves to apply a blanket ban on all RC aircraft sales, while they figure out what to do.

 

 

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Steve J
On 21/12/2018 at 11:09, Sloper said:

issues raised in this incident is that authorities don't know how to react to the threat.

They seem to have reacted by mobilising a counter-UAV system that the Army bought earlier in the year and employing some old fashioned police work.

Doubtless Gatwick and the other large airports in the UK will be installing UAV detection and tracking systems next year. There was a trial of a system at Southend last summer and big exercise at Manchester a few weeks ago (Operation Zenith).

Steve

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Steve J
11 hours ago, Richard Swindells said:

It felt to me like no-one from the traditional RC hobby had spoken to them up to that point, or if they had, they had not put their point across effectively. 

That was the impression that I got when I did the questionnaire that they put out.

Steve

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Steve J
18 hours ago, pete beadle said:

Almost as fact free as a BMFA press release

It is factual. It's not actually saying very much, but that is different matter. An example of an "almost fact free" statement would be the one made by the shadow transport minister.

Steve

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
pete beadle

Hi Richard

I'm glad to see you got good value from attending this consultation/workshop - BTW who are the company contracted to implement drone registration and implementation please?

I'm fairly sure that the main reason no other hobbyists weren't present because they don't see the sense in listening to a presentation when, in their opinion, the fight (if there is one) is already lost. My personal investigations into the views of other flyers at Ivinghoe, and other clubs produced largely negative feedback where most who answered, they said that they felt that the introduction of these new regulations was effectively a fait accompli already. Some said that these new regulations provided just the push they needed to give up the hobby, some actually said they were going to take up R/C sailing as a substitute and others said they felt they were now too old for "one last big fight"

When you said you thought that no other hobbyists had spoken to them up to this point did you ask if the BMFA had approached them yet? or perhaps you already have the answer to that one?

One thing that did seem to appear in each and every conversation I had was that everyone they spoke to, especially members of the public knew and understood that R/C gliders were definitely NOT drones and were surprised that we couldn't convince the legislators of that fact

I see from the TV news yesterday that two arrests have been made in the Gatwick investigation - I am also surprised that I'm the first to mention that fact......

Regards

Pete

BARCS1702

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Dave Elam

There's an interesting thread on Facebook started by Andy Ellison. The employer (John Allard) of the suspect who has been arrested has been posting saying that it cannot have been him as he was working on a site, miles away from Gatwick, with two more of his employees.

Also worrying is the fact that John Allard, as of one hour ago, still hasn't even been contacted by the police. He's convinced he is innocent.

Having said all that it has to be said that there appears to have been on further reports of drone activity over Gatwick.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
pete beadle

Hi Dave

I'm assuming the name you mentioned featured in Andy Ellison's Facebook thread?

The police have been very careful to NOT release names at this point,Having said that I'm not surprised the employer thinks his employee is innocent but I'm also not surprised that the police haven't yet called on him, I believe he is NOT a witness or a relative.....also, we have already established that the operator of this drone or drones could be a considerable distance from Gatwick.....possibly even more remotely from their laptop..... 

This enquiry may not seem fast-moving to us but I personally believe the police are doing their best and trying not to make mistakes that may be held against them when any suspects are eventually established and arrested. I'm convinced that what will be a landmark case, when it finally comes to court, is not going to be marred by any subsequent accusations that currently existing  procedures have not been correctly followed 

In my opinion, naming names too early is a major mistake......made often by the press, rarely by the police

Regards

Pete

BARCS1702

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Steve J
Quote

Sussex Police said the pair were no longer suspects.

Det Ch Supt Jason Tingley said: "Both people have fully co-operated with our enquiries and I am satisfied that they are no longer suspects in the drone incidents at Gatwick.

"Our inquiry continues at a pace to locate those responsible for the drone incursions, and we continue to actively follow lines of investigation."

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-46665615

Steve

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
EssexBOF

BMFA  response on Facebook

 

British Model Flying Association

20 December at 10:56 ·

A statement from the BMFA's CEO, David Phipps.

"The BMFA has been asked to comment on the disruption caused by reports of drone incursions overnight at Gatwick Airport.

In the absence of the full details, we would not wish to speculate on the situation. However, the irresponsible actions are not helpful to us at a time when we are in the midst of ongoing negotiations with the Government on behalf of the model flying community.

All we can say with certainty is that it is impossible to legislate for idiots and the situation at Gatwick simply serves to demonstrate the difficulty in enforcing the law on those who deliberately choose to disregard it."

www.bmfa.org

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest

I don't fly very much  anymore but still trying to stay current with what's going on in the rc hobby.

I find it quite worrying the guys photos were splashed all over the internet yesterday, along with his wife, before he'd even been charged with anything. Whether or not he was cleared today, now makes no difference whats so ever. Even bringing his employer into this and naming where he works. We all know in reality how things are gonna go for that guy now over the next few weeks/months. 

Any even more worrying that BBC News article seems to focus on the fact this guy had rc helis, drones and even a car! So basically, even though you guys fight to not have your sailplanes classed as drones in the law and public eyes, basically if anything like this happened near us, even owning a rc car, or selling something rc related 2 years ago, could still make you a suspect, or at least have you one in the publics eyes if not the laws. 

World has gone mad, stop, I want to get off. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
pete beadle

Hi Mark

I think that what you are suggesting would have better been directed to the news media 

There is a thing called "the court of public opinion" which is, I believe, what you are actually complaining about ,which they are mainly responsible for fuelling at times like this - tell them, but don't expect them to explain their actions or why they do this!........

Regards

Pete

BARCS1702

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
pete beadle

Hi Whitmore

Surely you are not referring to Grant SHAPPS MP for Welwyn, Hatfield  and ex Chairman of the Conservative Party:(

Regards

Pete

BARCS1702

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Steve J
2 hours ago, i_am_mark_evans said:

I find it quite worrying the guys photos were splashed all over the internet yesterday, along with his wife, before he'd even been charged with anything. Whether or not he was cleared today, now makes no difference whats so ever. Even bringing his employer into this and naming where he works. We all know in reality how things are gonna go for that guy now over the next few weeks/months. 

Hopefully the couple who were arrested will end up with some nice cheques from the vermin tabloids.  We really could do with a privacy law in this country to stop people being identified by the press before they are charged (and in some cases, before they are found guilty).

Steve

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Steve J
2 hours ago, pete beadle said:

Surely you are not referring to Grant SHAPPS MP for Welwyn, Hatfield  and ex Chairman of the Conservative Party:(

I believe that @Whitmore is referring to Grant Shapps MP, Chair of the All Party Parliamentary Group on General Aviation who produced this rather worrying release -

http://www.generalaviationappg.uk/parliamentary-aviation-group-pledges-support-for-tough-new-drone-abuse-laws/

Steve 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Whitmore

I was just flagging up a relevant comment, not expressing any opinion. The  mention he made of model aircraft in that interview seems to show that 'traditional' modelling is not a deliberate or at least conscious target of the legislation (however effectively or not it is implemented is another matter) .

Thanks for the link Steve J - very interesting.

It's pretty obvious that the Gatwick incident shows up that the  problem is enforcement of the existing legislation.

 

As to 'accountability' - I always put my address on my models and would be pleased to have them returned when the police find them 🤨

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Steve J
2 minutes ago, Whitmore said:

Thanks for the link Steve J - very interesting.

Here is another one for you -

https://www.altitudeangel.com/blog/gatwick-airport-disruption-due-to-reported-drone-sightings/

2 minutes ago, Whitmore said:

As to 'accountability' - I always put my address on my models an would be pleased to have them returned when the police find them 

A club mate was advised by the police not to put his address on models as it tells somebody who finds it where they can find more. I generally put a mobile phone number on mine.

Steve

 

  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
EssexBOF

See this link from the USA, does not make good viewing for our authorities, of any persuasion

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
pete beadle

Hi all

I wonder why this chappie wasn't wearing his tinfoil hat that prevents aliens from contacting him?

The worst thing for me, sitting through all this claptrap, was that I'll never get the 14.50 minutes back - thanks for that Brian:(

and he didn't even have the good manners to thank the people that died over all the years so that he could enjoy this pathetic rant without fear of retribution

Ah well, Merry Christmas and a peaceful New Year in 2019 chaps and let's hope this poor, misguided  old fella has the same........peace and goodwill to all at Christmas time remember!:)

Regards

Pete

BARCS1702

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Restore formatting

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.


  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

We have placed cookies on your device to help make this website better. You can adjust your cookie settings, otherwise we'll assume you're okay to continue.