conwy soarer Posted July 21, 2011 Share Posted July 21, 2011 SO here we go I have been doodling in my sketchbook and have started laying down some lines in CAD. Its DNA lies in the following:WasabiVectorMini VectorSonicand many othersWing span is as yet undecided but will be between 1.5 and 2.5m, fuselage will be laser cut from birch ply with a bit of balsa to give some rounded curviness - old school. Wings might be blue foam veneered, or may be built up with ply?? skins. Wing is probably going to be 2 piece but who knows it may end up one piece if its sub 2M, at the moment its got just ailerons but who knows I might add flaps. Aerofoil I am thinking of TP42 but am open to suggestions. The plan is to get the drawings done for a winter build.Jon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil.Taylor Posted July 21, 2011 Share Posted July 21, 2011 Nice Sonic-esque fus there – if you are building old-skool, you may need to deepen(widen?) it a bit near the fin to get enough material/strength in there – sort of Sonic-meets-Phase6. Plan the material out first & see what it will look like at the back endthink I'd go for ailerons as a constant % of the chord – that keeps the hinge line straight if top or bottom hingedif 2.0-2.5m – I'd add flaps too – for crowPhil. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
f3fman Posted July 21, 2011 Share Posted July 21, 2011 Maybe you could share the following info with us too ?What are you wanting the model to be able to do ?What lift conditions are you expecting to fly in ?Are you designing a new model just for the sake of something different, or are you trying to improve on other models ?If you are "trying to improve" on other models then what aspects are you trying to improve and what are you trying to keep in your new design ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
conwy soarer Posted July 21, 2011 Author Share Posted July 21, 2011 f3fman said: Maybe you could share the following info with us too ?What are you wanting the model to be able to do ?A bit of an aerobatWhat lift conditions are you expecting to fly in ?Great Orme - excellent lift most of the timeAre you designing a new model just for the sake of something different, or are you trying to improve on other models ?Just cos I like designing and have some spare balsa n ply n stuffIf you are "trying to improve" on other models then what aspects are you trying to improve and what are you trying to keep in your new design ?Not really just letting the pencil and brain have a bit of a danceI have many sketchbooks full of doodles, I quite liked the kipperish retro shapes that led to this one, I have also been playing around with a 1 metre version with a soild balsa wing and a S7012 hand sanded near enough foil. Jon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
conwy soarer Posted July 21, 2011 Author Share Posted July 21, 2011 Phil.Taylor said: Nice Sonic-esque fus there – if you are building old-skool, you may need to deepen(widen?) it a bit near the fin to get enough material/strength in there – sort of Sonic-meets-Phase6. Plan the material out first & see what it will look like at the back endthink I'd go for ailerons as a constant % of the chord – that keeps the hinge line straight if top or bottom hingedif 2.0-2.5m – I'd add flaps too – for crowPhil.Agree there Phil, printed out the tail end full size scaled at 2400 mm span and it could be a little weak so I have added a bit fairing into the fin, keeping the lower line the same, have also changed the ailerons from being constant chord, it looks better to, with them being constant chord there is an illusion that they are getting wider towards the tip. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
conwy soarer Posted August 3, 2011 Author Share Posted August 3, 2011 Some progress, as well as drawing up the larger one I also drew a 1000 mm span version with a shoulder mounted one piece solid balsa wing (like the Mini Phase I built 30 or so years ago)I laser cut .8mm ply components for the fuselage, AMT and wing sanding templates for the S7012 section.I have completed most of the fuselage and am in the process of final sanding and making a solid balsa carved canopy.Hopefully today I will get a chance to make a start on the wing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gonesoaring2003 Posted August 3, 2011 Share Posted August 3, 2011 looking good!Is the AMT bellcrank cut from ply? How did you know what angle worked (it looks more than 90 degrees)? the pivot point for the AMT seems a long way forward, kinda like a huge elevator I guess? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
conwy soarer Posted August 3, 2011 Author Share Posted August 3, 2011 Gonesoaring2003 said: All guess work really - the pivot point is about 1/3 back from the LE of the AMT and the AMT horn is cranked forward at 106 (again all guess work. It is laser cut from 3 laminations of .8mm ply with a disc of the same either side at the pivot point. Aerodynamically speaking I wasnt sure of the ideal position of the pivot I figured just forward of the 1/3 mark would be OK. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gonesoaring2003 Posted August 3, 2011 Share Posted August 3, 2011 The laser cutting looks amazing!When you say the pivot point is 1/3 back on the AMT does this mean the AMT will extend forward of the fin? as the pivot point looks close to the leading edge of the fin? Hope this makes sense.Alex Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil.Taylor Posted August 3, 2011 Share Posted August 3, 2011 conwy soarer said: Gonesoaring2003 said: Aerodynamically speaking I wasnt sure of the ideal position of the pivot I figured just forward of the 1/3 mark would be OK.looking good so farRe. AMT pivot point - I strongly recommend you set the pivot point at 25% chord of the tail (mean aerodynamic chord) - thats close to the aerodynamic centre to avoid flutter problemsMy Kulbutin gets really bad tail flutter - its at 39% - going to be rebuilt to 25%Phil. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bartplus4 Posted August 3, 2011 Share Posted August 3, 2011 Is their a reason why the tail crank is not at 90 degrees. Does this introduce some sort of mechanical differential.I am currently building a fibreglass fuse version of the old RCME Gnott design and was planning on using a 90 degree crank.Your thoughts would be appreaciated.Ian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
conwy soarer Posted August 3, 2011 Author Share Posted August 3, 2011 Gonesoaring2003 said: The laser cutting looks amazing!When you say the pivot point is 1/3 back on the AMT does this mean the AMT will extend forward of the fin? as the pivot point looks close to the leading edge of the fin? Hope this makes sense.Alex AMT pivot centre is 18mm back from the LE of the fin (its actually 18.7mm on the drawing) I think the photo is misleading TBH due to the fact its wide angle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woodstock Posted August 4, 2011 Share Posted August 4, 2011 Bartplus4 said: Is their a reason why the tail crank is not at 90 degrees. Does this introduce some sort of mechanical differential.I am currently building a fibreglass fuse version of the old RCME Gnott design and was planning on using a 90 degree crank.Your thoughts would be appreaciated.IanI started thinking about your post, and I've got a headache now... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
conwy soarer Posted August 4, 2011 Author Share Posted August 4, 2011 Not to sure about differential, TBH I cranked it forward a tad cos one of the old MM ones I have in the spares box is that way – and they were used in the Mini Racer Garth and Deri is used to have. Thinking about it is giving me a head ache too! – back to sanding! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lee Morgan Posted August 4, 2011 Share Posted August 4, 2011 More pictures please mr builder person Cheers Lee Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
conwy soarer Posted August 4, 2011 Author Share Posted August 4, 2011 Lee Morgan said: More pictures please mr builder person Cheers LeeWill do, had a bit of DIY today Harry Potter tonight and back in the hangar tomorrow! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
conwy soarer Posted August 5, 2011 Author Share Posted August 5, 2011 Managed to get a bit more done today:Assembled and sanded the canopy/hatch and faired it into the noseblock area.Sanded the rudder and decided to make it fixed on this first one, purely due to the fact that I did not have any snakes or closed loop stuff and couldnt get out.I will be fitting a rudder to the second prototype!!!Glued together the 10 mm balsa to make the wingSanded and planed the top surface of the wing (this only took 27mins)I forgot how much fun this method is (been a long time since my Mini Phase!!)Anyway here are some more pics of progress.Tailplane and wing underside tomorrow and if I get time I will let in some carbon strip as a spar on the wing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lee Morgan Posted August 5, 2011 Share Posted August 5, 2011 Love to see people bashin balsa and stuff , Can't do it myself ( can't be arsed ) lol Keep the pics coming it looks great Lee Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
f3fman Posted August 5, 2011 Share Posted August 5, 2011 It's looking really good, hand me the Tx when it's built !Build in some servo wire down the fuselage to the tail so you can retro-fit a cheap 9gm metal geared servo when you discover you really want a rudder after all, it looks like it would fit in the "hole" in the tail above the tailplane linkage and drive the servo direct.Better still, do it now ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
conwy soarer Posted August 6, 2011 Author Share Posted August 6, 2011 Wing is finished, spar in, servo pockets made and tips have been added and shaped, started covering today.servo pocket cut, waste material reglued in to create the pocketexcess waste material from creating servo pocketafter planing and sanding flushwing almost covered. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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